95 replies to this topic

[Deval]

Dude, the people who own a massive number of alts will be the only ones to get the quests. How are minimalists meant to stand a chance against the throngs of alts?

[Bean]

I know!

Ok, Im not gonna say. I want everyone to think devals question over and hand me a report on my desk by tommorow. Dismissed

Wha... Not? Oh crap... stupid lucid dreams

[Tienno]

"Glad a war is being planned" refers to the fact someone has done a quest and it isnt that odd really when you read it in the context it was written. The fact it refered to the fact something was happening and not some pro war rant which i feel you may have taken it as.

[Lady_Maha]

Now that I am back online, my 2 cents as well.

It is called a MUD game... multi USER dungeon, not MAD game multi ALT dungeon.

The training, the bosses, quests, can all still be done with one alt only. People will just have to do the one thing that appearently doesn't seem to be a possibility in the alt defenders' minds: Work together not with your own alts, but with OTHER PLAYERS! I am sure the clans, friend list and all that pretty stuff was put there for a reason... meet up... do things together... why else would you be in a clan or have friends? If someone can play the whole game, including boss drops and quests by themselves without interacting with others, it is kind of ironic to call it a MUD.

The one thing I like most about this game IS the interaction with other people, and a one alt limit would pretty much force people to work together to achieve something. That way the game would be fair to all the poor Win98 users out there who can't just log on a bazillion crits at once. When your status in the game is determined by your operating system and internet speed something needs to be changed. Limit alts, meet people, work together and show how well you REALLY play the game!

[Lich]

A one alt limit meaning you can play one crit other than your main is a decent idea. It is the perfect solution because of two things. One It allows people to use one alt if they prefer and still allows those who dont want to run around with just one crit. (My god you mean i have to do this alone.) To have more than one crit on.

At the same time it Does make you have to work together. You dont even need to really lower monsters or boss, It would just mean that you would have to team up with more people to get the drops.

I know people in this game who pk with one alt still and that is who we know them as.

But we can make this easy i am starting a poll for this vote if you want dont vote if you dont.

Then will be no reason to fight simply vote and its over then either way there is a set count for staff to see and debate on.

[trauma]

well if you guys want to use just one alt, they got a game out called revelation.. go download that, nightmist is fine the way it is..

[Squee]

Well, if you guys want to use a bazillion alts, they got a game out called Warcraft III... Go buy that. Nightmist needs to be changed.

[Deval]

Interact with players from around the world. Form allegiances and travel expansive regions, questing for riches, priceless artifacts, and most importantly, fame.

Nightmist is a community-based game. Player interaction is an integral part of gameplay, from the transaction of various armors and wares, to player-versus-player combat.

Ok, I want all you pro-alt nimrods to guess where that is taken from. Go on, GUESS.

[Amy]

*Amy grins at Deval holding up her Pro-alt sign.. * umm.. the description of nightmist.. ? she winks at him.. "YOu are cool deval, but am still pro alt .. if you can play them properly and enjoy doing so.. you should be able to use more than one crit.* Good day, Amy

[Squee]

Ugh...but how many people just abuse alts?

[user] just felt the wrath of Squee's mighty beam!

[user] pages you: omg u stupd homofag, i loggin all meh alts and pwnzd ur azz!!!!11

[Bean]

I would hazard a guess that more than 90% of nightmist abuses alts.

I am very proud to say I am not one of those people. Only time I've ever used alts is when I train in the swamps *Because its nearly impossible without one cleric*, And my druids *They are brothers*. Other than that, 99.99% of my pking is done on one alt *Lvl 10 I might add*.

I acctually LIKE playing one alt more than playing multiple alts... I just seems more FUN to me... I acctually have a challenge getting through most dungeons, whereas I could just make 10+ crits, and do it easily. I choose the more... I would say rewarding of the two.

But thats just me, all you alt users just carry on. I'm not the one to stop you.

[Amy]

I think it all boils down to personal choice..

I have fun at times on 1 alt only.. and in events where only 1 alt can be used, I still try to participate in. Do some "abuse alts?" perhaps, that is a matter of perception. I use tons of alts at times, but, would like to think that I do it to just train, not to abuse the system.

Good day,
Amy

[Harky]

Just an idea that came to me as a result of misreading someone else's post. How about if certain penalties were put in place as the result of using alts, not stopping people totally - but giving them more incentive to just use one?. Just like arena's exp was dropped to persuade people to go into the wild.

Example of what I propose:

Leveling - the more alts that are connected to the server from one machine would drop the amount of experience that player earns. For example

One alt: 110% experience compared to the amount recieved now, 100% experience for pacifists as they don't need to put up with factors such as being pk'ed, which was pointed out on a previous thread.
Two alts: 80% experience
Three alts: 70% experience
More alts: -10% experience until it reaches seven alts, where any more and it remains constant at 35%.

PK'ing/pvp - tricky, but I guess the only way to have an impact on this would be to affect gold earned. It won't really make a difference to most, I know I never pk'ed to earn gold. At least I guess it would add some benefit for one alt users.

One alt: All gold from victim is recieved.
Two alts: 75% of gold from victim is recieved, the other 25%? I guess it can remain on the victim, or just disappear? not very realistic I know, anyone can come up with some other idea go ahead.
Three alts: 50% gold
Four alts: 25% gold
Five alts or more, no gold.

[Cule]

hmmm ... this comes a little late tho but here:

after reading these posts, people got it wrong ...

nightmist isnt a mud its a graphical mud/half mud so to say ...

there are a lot of mud games out there ( like gazillions ) for gamers like squee to play if they want to rp ...

but what comes to this alt business ... its very much possible to survive with only one crit and still having fun ... it only needs some interaction with players.

if all would only have one crit....
interaction would be must and there would be alotta people at pub:s to collect "merceneries" to go questing with them ... not only good for rp:ing but to bring the game a lil feel as you would have to plan every quest carefully so that you wouldnt hire some traitors that would kill you half way the trip or to bring the right classes to right bosses ( or to real quests ... real quests would be sooo cool )

nightmist is a half mud and being a half mud there lies its strength ( my opinion )

edit: oh and ... i vote for 4 crits that you can only use one at a time.

Edited by Cule, 30 May 2004 - 04:43 AM.

[deadman]

nightmist is fine the way it is got a prob with ppl using alts? go get some of urs or train some up and fight back the game was made this way it will probably stay this way no matter what u say or do. so mine as well quit the complaining and a million posts of alt limits.. they arent needed game is fine the way it is.. so just give it up already..

dont like it dont play simple.

[Squee]

I absolutely hate it when people just tell me to "go train some alts". This game was made so you could play with alts, sure, I'll give you that.

Was this game made so the strongest person was determined by who could micromanage the most efficiently? I highly doubt it.

I know now that this game will never become 1-alt and it pains me to say so...but it's the truth. However, it doesn't mean I'm going to give up my ideals. I tell you now that you would enjoy this game 10 times more if everyone played alts. I play 1-alt (a mage to boot) and I love the game. It's hard for me to compete with any other player because I need to stay close to town for mana and health boosts (unless I'm with a party). In fact, it's near impossible...but I still find enjoyment in it. I'm not the strongest player, I'm not the smartest player, I'm not the player that steals to make a fortune, I'm not even the player who trains crits just to sell them, I'm just that player who genuinely enjoys the game.

Telling me to join the bandwagon is a terrible thing to say.

"Mr. Mackenzie King? People are just slaughtering jews now. I think we should just hop on the bandwagon and take out a few Rabis before we all get hurt."

I really don't think it's fair that if I end up killing a person out of defence, they can come back and overwhelm me with 20:1 odds. That's what I call abuse of alts. I know some people use alts well. I know that some people use them "fairly" but for every 1 of those people, I can guarantee you that there are 5 more that just use alts because it gives them a seemingly "instant" power-boost.

I hate the fact that your worth is determined by the collective sum of all your alts' levels. I hate the fact that I will never become "rich" because I don't "deal with alts". I hate the fact that I can't beat a boss because my account isn't topped to the brim with Archmaster Fighters.

I love how everyone who knows me, knows me as "Squee". Just Squee. No Squee_The_Second, no Squees_Main, not even Squee_The_Impaler. I love how, if I need help, I am forced to turn to people...not just my /load [alt] command. I love how I can walk into the Hunters' Tavern and not lag out some poor person, living in some remote place in Antartica with an 8k modem. I love how the game is more fun when I only use one alt.

If I don't like it, I just shouldn't play it? How do you know I'm wrong. Maybe it's you that should have to leave. Maybe you're the plague on this game, not me. Maybe you're the people that annoy us. Maybe it's time to look beyond your account and see that a 1-alt Limit will actually benefit Nightmist in the (not so distant) future. If you people would just read 1-Alt suggestions (a great one was out-layed by Hanavor), you'd see it doesn't hinder you at all...

...That is, of course, unless you actually enjoy micro-managing. In which case, go to your local Electronics Store and pick up a copy of Starcraft or Warcraft or Age of Empires.

Edited by Deval, 01 June 2004 - 03:24 AM.

[deadman]

how about the game stays the way it is and u just quit complaining bc its going to get u nowhere. We play this game bc we like it the way it is if u are going to keep complaining that itd be better with a one alt limit then go play a game with a one alt limit its fine he way it is leave it at that and quit complaining.

[Deval]

Deadman, the only advantage you have in this discussion is your titanium skull which is literally impenetrable to all forms of information and discussion. Your last (insert stupid number) of posts on this topic have been the same thing over and over from square one. You have not given any reasons why it should not happen, or not cohearant ones at least. Instead you choose to simply state the same stupid remark over and over and over; You are lending nothing to the argument. If your not going to read, or at least consider the posts and opinions of other people on this thread, don't bother clicking on it.

[Angelus]

Make it one alt or make it a thousand. The people who own now will still own then, after i equiped my main with a cobalt etc. then whats there to do?

[lowmion]

I'm just in the process of upgrading my pc and o/s, etc

That will allow me to if needed to run multiple alts, but they'ld mainly be 'pack-mules'.

It all depends on what class you like to play as to your point of view on the alts debate,

But like Angelus said, 1 alt or many, there are some players that will make sure they have the best crits, equip, and rank.

I'll still play mainly with 1 or 2 alts maximum no matter what my pc is capable of, but when i joined the Nightmist Realm it was a game of multi-alts, I had the choice not to play this game but choose to play it and lvl my characters, and by doing this 'accepted' the 'alt army' reality that is Nightmist,

Maybe you Squee should realise the same,

Nightmist isnt anything else but Nightmist, keep it that way, if you want to play something that isnt Nightmist, so be it, but don't try to make Nightmist into that other game.

I like Nightmist and enjoy Nightmist for being unlike any other game that's about.

[Deval]

Nightmist isnt anything else but Nightmist, keep it that way, if you want to play something that isnt Nightmist, so be it, but don't try to make Nightmist into that other game.

Lowmion, what you seem to have missed here, is that prior to being bombarded with new, shallow, reputation driven 13 year olds, this was wasn't hindered with the overuse of alts. Go back a few pages and look at my post, or just look at the opening page where it describes how the game is meant to be played. So Nightmist was wrecked when you got here and you developed your style of play that way, well guess what, you developed an erroneous style of play, but unfortunately, that is now the norm. I want the opening page on this game changed, this isn't about working with friends anymore, nor crafting a name for a well developed character. Allow me to adjust the Nightmist opening page, in the hopes that it may be changed, and players know what they are in for. I will put the hipocritical or emphasis points in bold.

Nightmist is a highly-involved icon/text-based MUD (Multi User Dungeon). Create a fully-customizable character with distinctive strengths and weakness'. Choose from one of nine classes, each one significantly influencing how you experience the game. Interact with players from around the world. Form allegiances and travel expansive regions, questing for riches, priceless artifacts, and most importantly, fame.

Nightmist is a community-based game. Player interaction is an integral part of gameplay, from the transaction of various armors and wares, to player-versus-player combat. Because the dynamic nature of the game may be a little confusing to those unaccustomed to the text-based genre, in-game help can be easily activated by typing 'help' at any time.

The fate of our world lies upon you, worthy adventurer. Will you chance the path of the hero, fighting for the deities of light, and striving for clarity in this turbulent world? Or perhaps you are a being of the shadows, vowing to wreak unearthly affliction on those unfortunate souls who dare cross your path. Be forewarned, however, as you strive to create a reputation for yourself in this land. Rarely do the gods forget a deed, and verily, your actions will be remembered.

Be well and have fun.

Now, this is what I propose it be changed to

Nightmist is a highly-involved icon/text-based MUD (Multi User Dungeon). Create a fully-customizable army resulting ultimately in a common skill set for all players. Choose each and every one of nine classes, each extra alt significantly influencing how overwhelming you can be to players with weaker hardware. Avoid players from around the world as you complete every task in the game with your own army and of your own accord. Form alts and travel expansive regions, questing for riches, priceless artifacts, and most importantly, fame.

Nightmist is a RTS, player interaction does not form an integral part of gameplay. All armors and wares, are available to he who has many alts, and you need only communicate with other players with respect to 'player-versus-player' combat. Because the dynamic nature of the game may be a little confusing to those unaccustomed to the text-based genre, in-game help can be easily activated by typing 'help' at any time.

The fate of our world lies upon you, worthy general. Will you chance the path of the wealthy, using countless numbers of alts, striving for omnipotence? Or perhaps you are an army of the shadows, vowing to wreak unearthly affliction on those unfortunate souls who dare cross your path. Be forewarned, however, as you strive to create a reputation for yourself in this land. Rarely do the gods forget a deed, and verily, your actions will be remembered.

Be well and have fun.

JLH or Pandilex, please change the opening page text to read this.

[lowmion]

-cough-

Actually, I play with 1 alt mostly, (packmule for my mage), and am definitely not 13, (physically anyway).

What I'm simply saying is that the current multi-alt format of Nightmist is what I choose to play 20 months ago, and choose to spend time leveling the hardest class mostly solo,

Sure ppl run around with mega alt pk parties, and i dont like that either, but ya cant force ppl to ya veiw, ya have to offer a compromise that keeps every-one happy, and is easy to implement into the current evolving format.

Who knows what the sys-ops have in mind for the next update? and if there will be an update.

Enjoy



Btw i do play/explore with friends, team work is a part of my clan's game-style, maybe ya just in the wrong clan ?

[Fossae]

I know this is late but I have playedtwo other online games and they only allow two alts at a time maybe that can happen here so there wont be just a person with 10 alts on at a time which is pointless anyways unless your in Animosity on thieves.

[Eyes in the Dark]

hmmm to post an opinion or not.

Ok, I agree that a 1 alt limit would be good. I am a fan of roleplaying, I love the whole aspect of the fantasy and I have to admit in game I use more than one...in fact I run with 4 including my main. I don;t do this for PK reasons or anything like that, but I do it because I like the roleplay. Each character is different, I am trying to build a party of characters like you would read about in books or on film. Each one has a purpose. No I didn't spend hours trying to roll 6 stats, but I designed a party to run with.

Yes I think that one alt would be good, it would increase the effort you would need to put into the game to get to the same place as with 10 alts. But I think that if this was introduced that a lot of gamers would leave, but I think, if this is wanting to go more RP I think there should be a no alt limit, like with Paci;s, that is what real RP is about, sure you would still get PK'ers out there, but more clan stuff. I think that if that was to happen, to protect the person running with one there should be more non PK areas, or even duelling arenas to allow PK'ing to be controlled

</my two cents>

[Raylen]

I think i may have said this before somewhere else...

I support Harky's idea, or at least the idea behind it. It would be nice if there was some kind of reward for people who only use 1 alt at a time. Say, 50% more exp or something. And maybe a couple of new areas added in for 1-alt only - but make them tough, so you need to get a few mates together to do it.

For me, i just like using alts, they are what makes the game great (imho). Squee, stop telling me to play other games, i've tried them and they can't beat this one

In any case, i've had a look at Revelation, which has been mentioned in connection with this topic a few times - if Nightmist were to go to 1-alt, it seems we have a long way to go to match the depth of that game. (item diversity, NPC interaction)

[Evilcloud]

well if you guys want to use just one alt, they got a game out called revelation.. go download that, nightmist is fine the way it is..

WOOT!


I think its bs that everyone that doesn't have good alts tries to penalize the ones that do... If you guys wanna role-play... go for it no-one is stopping you.... but i could kill you wit 1 arch just as easy as i could wit 7-10 arches.. Pking/Getting Pked is part of the game... GET USED TO IT

[Squee]

I could begin building up an army of alts. That way, whenever I get killed, I can just log those on and blah blah blah. The end.

However, wouldn't you agree that the whole ideal of multi-alt using turns Nightmist (a MuD) into an RTS (real time strategy)?
I mean, if we could start training workers to build us Barracks, I wouldn't be surprised at all.

Also, a 1-alt limit wouldn't stop PK'ing at all. A PK'er will stay a PK'er. They will find the weapons that let them murder others the most efficiently and they will develop cheap clever tactics that will give them the upper hand in any surprise attack.

If I wanted this 1-alt limit just to stop PK'ing, at the end of everyone of my posts, I would write "And then you should take out player killing. There's on room for that."

I know that PK'ing is part of the game. In fact, I used to PK any innocent that I'd come across in my forest. I've come to realize that that whole perspective is just dumb.

If you're seriously that blood-hungry, go out and Beta-Test some new First Person Shooter. That way, you're actually beating people through skill, not through your ability to micro-manage, hit Alt+Tab quickly and set Macros.

Squee, stop telling me to play other games...

As soon as others stop telling me to play Revelations.

[Evilcloud]

I am sorry Squee. I should know not to resort to insults when you pointed out valid reasons against my argument.

Edited by Deval, 17 June 2004 - 11:05 PM.

[Mec]

It isn't fine though, thats the problem. Adding an alt rule would be awesome

Explain to me the problem with Nightmist as is. If the game is really that flawed, then why do people play it at all?

For you, an alt limit might be awesome, but I think you still fail to see that not everyone likes the idea. I understand it gets really annoying when a person logs 10 alts, kills off 2 crits and considers it an accomplishment.. but restricting their methods just so you can get a bit more training makes no sense. What would be the point of having a large group of crits that you took the time to train just sitting in the account? If you put the work into a crit, you should be able to use it. And besides, making this change would just ignite many more unneccesary ones, like tweaking bosses so that a smaller group of crits can take them. If you change one thing, you'll have to change many more.. and there is always one new change that nobody likes, so in a sense, you'd be "solving" one problem to start a thousand others.

You've got your definitions ermm.... different than mine are. Please correect my definitions.

Mmorpgs don't need graphics. RPGs don't need graphics. MUDs can have graphics. Seriously, Nightmist is more like a high quality MUSH than anything, in my opinion.

In my idea of an RPG(Role-playing Game), you just play the role of your character. You aren't you, you're someone else. No other requirements are there for an RPG, you can talk as you, or your character, it doesn't really matter, you just aren't yourself.

Muds(Multi-user Dungeon or Dimension) usually have text, that is because they strongly encourage roleplaying. You are right. However, MuDs are usually very realistic, a tad bit more than nightmist. How realistic is it to have people, "wut lvl r u, wut lvl r u, n00b". all over. A mud is a kind of RPG I think, thank you very much.


A MUSH (multi-user shared hallucination) usually makes no attempt to encourage roleplaying. it could have some realistic descriptions, but not really gameplay.

How realistic is it for us to be 'paging' people around the world. How realistic is it to be able to travel from town to town in a matter of seconds facing drastic terrain changes.

This is why I think nightmist is a mush. The staff do want it to be more of a MuD, and encourage roleplaying, but still it's more of a mush.

Edited by Mec, 20 June 2004 - 12:18 AM.

[Squee]

In my idea of an RPG(Role-playing Game), you just play the role of your character. You aren't you, you're someone else. No other requirements are there for an RPG, you can talk as you, or your character, it doesn't really matter, you just aren't yourself.

Not to nit-pick but, by that definition, Mario 64 is an RPG. I think when most people say RPG, they mean Conventional RPG, meaning: EXP, Equipment, NPCs, etc.