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Title: more insanity! Post by dognapot on 12/08/03 at 06:22:42 i've always been one to nag about how nightmist has gone too far in the wrong direction when it comes to accomadating alts. however, it's true; we have gone to far in nightmist. imagine if all of the sudden you could only log one alt on at a time. you couldn't play the game very well anymore. everything is geared towards using requiring many crits controlled by one or more people. in about march of 2001 the bosses that existed were strengthened to represent a challenge to the masses of players that knocked the crap out of them each day. since then things have been built to require more force to conquer while the means of acquiring the requisite force have remained the same. but the game isn't the only thing that has gone too far. players have also. this isn't final fantasy. you shouldn't need to have a fighter, mage, cleric, and a theif just to get around. nor should have to have 4 theives, 3 fighters and a cleric, or any other combination for the sake of simply surviving. yet that is the case. so what i'm suggesting here is a new server for nightmist that would be built around individual character development. not simply a 1-alt limit but a world that could be fully enjoyed by one person of almost any class. i've suggested ideas to work toward that same goal in nightmist, but it's too true, it's more work than it's worth. every area built since early 2001 has been built with the largest possible parties in mind. so it's not really going to happen any other way is it? so what do we think? would you play if you could only be one character at a time? would you work in a world like that? discuss. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Epic on 12/08/03 at 07:06:21 I wouldnt mind playing only being able to use one crit at a time BUT i've already gone through one reset and not looking to go through another one |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by dognapot on 12/08/03 at 07:40:43 no reset. just another nightmist server. you could play one or the other or both. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Epic on 12/08/03 at 08:20:10 Ohooo i gotchya |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Shane on 12/08/03 at 12:52:34 I forsee in the near furture of this thread a post about cash for this second server. Seeing as the current one is funded only from JLH's own pocket do you think he would fund another out of his other pocket? |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Lich on 12/08/03 at 14:37:38 Why cant you just reprogram the existing servers to only allow one alt at a time. You could leave the monsters the same as they are right now. Then both the goal requested here plus the goal of staff would be met. People would still have to go in partys to kill bosses but those bosses would have to be attacked by more then one player as staff intended when they made them. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Jurian on 12/08/03 at 15:16:10 1 alt limit and i'm out for obvious reasons :D |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Angelus on 12/08/03 at 15:29:14 1 crit is way to boring..cuz there isnt much to do. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Mephistroth on 12/08/03 at 15:35:46 Theres just as much to do with one alt. All you actually have to do is group with friends or clannies, which isn't a problem as far as I can see. I much prefer one crit only. It makes the game far more interesting as you actually have to work together. This might also improve the game in general, as it would force people to be more friendly towards each other (unless they don't want to ever be able to train or kill bosses) I doubt very much that this will happen though. If it did however, the only way it would work is with a reset (if its on the same server as the current one) and most people won't agree with that. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by dognapot on 12/08/03 at 15:51:57 ok. server = another nightmist server program running on the same physical server as the nightmist you're playing now. sort of like how nightmist and angel's games can run on the same server. no reset. you can still play! this doesn't affect you if you don't want to be affected. there's no reset. take my word for it, i made this up, and nowhere did i mention there'd have to be a reset. so, and i'm trying to make this more understandable, what i'm suggesting is another nightmist 'world'. this world won't accept alts, but that's 'okay', because it would be built around working with one alt. you can still play the other alt-happy nightmist, it'll still be there, and it won't be affected at all by this. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Angelus on 12/08/03 at 15:52:05 Yea right, one crit, if you're a fighter all you can do is attack...thats like clicking looped error messages. Anyways if this is gonne happen we need skills etc...otherwise every player is the same. Every arch will almost have the same equip etc...and with just playing 1 thats boring. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by dognapot on 12/08/03 at 15:58:06 on 12/08/03 at 14:37:38, Lich wrote:
it won't work because people will say 'screw it' when half thier work becomes useless and thier crits values depreciates. it also isn't fair to those who wouldn't have had a chance to compete in the same way as we have now. alts are a great benefit for training and money-making. it's unfair to the rest of nightmist to give some a gigantic lead and then shut everyone off from ever catching up. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by dognapot on 12/08/03 at 16:07:26 on 12/08/03 at 15:52:05, Angelus wrote:
you may not have noticed but as long as you're not a healing class... all you can do is attack. on 12/08/03, dognapot wrote:
of course things are going to have to be different than they are on nightmist now. duh, classes may have to be worked on, etc. but it won't be any more boring than nightmist is now. there have been times, you know, where 1 crit was the norm. it wasn't boring then. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Snowy on 12/08/03 at 16:43:07 ID really want nightmist be 1 alt at time.. but i know its not possible so yes this server idea would be great, id wouldnt make so much lag cuz i know ppl that ll play 1 alt at time instead of 'alt happy' nm |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Consumed on 12/08/03 at 16:46:36 i wouldnt like it...thats the only reason i didnt like rev... |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Angelus on 12/08/03 at 16:56:49 on 12/08/03 at 16:07:26, dognapot wrote:
But in different ways...anyways this would be way to much of a change so if you want it, there are other games that are already set up like this. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by dognapot on 12/08/03 at 17:52:19 knucklehead. it wouldn't be a change it would be an addition. there's not an "either or" ultimatum here. you can have both. if anyone thinks that 1 crit at a time is too dull can simply not play on the 1-crit server and just continue playing on the nightmist that's going on now. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Angelus on 12/08/03 at 17:57:04 on 12/08/03 at 17:52:19, dognapot wrote:
err..yea whatever dont piss me off Anyways, seeing as how fast updates are going you think JLH has time for this? |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by alone on 12/08/03 at 18:03:38 on 12/08/03 at 17:57:04, Angelus wrote:
That's the whole point, it wouldn't take much of a change at all. I know of lots of games that use two servers.. As JLH has said before, Nightmist only uses like 10% (was it?) or his CPU, so I'm sure he could run two at once. Back on the matter of it. I love the idea.. But then, why would someone want to play on the server that's harder and more work.. When, on the other, they can do everything alone. Cus as I'm sure you know, half of Nightmistians are social rejects, who can't do much more than kill another. P.S: I didn't mean you (looking at everyone, as to not cause offence) |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by dognapot on 12/08/03 at 18:12:10 also, it wouldn't be entirely as much work as it may seem. nightmist has been salvaging opal spheres for ages, now nightmist can salvage nightmist. the 1-crit world would take less bandwidth (net and cpu) because people would be limited to using one crit, instead of using multiple crits on the other server. it would also create an enviroment that's more accomadating to RP since it's not particularly easy to RP against a group of crits that serve as different facets one person's demolition team. it would aslo encourage players to use wits to accomplish thier goals in game. often now, it's a viable option to simply apply more force to create a solution, but when that's not available it can serve as inspiration for more creative, efficient, or social solutions. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Bean on 12/08/03 at 18:28:21 This idea would be pretty cool... The only thing I see stopping it from happening is a possible large ammount of coding. That, and people that dont understand that they would still be able to choose from nightmist as it is now, and the newly created server... I would enjoy being able to acctually take only ONE of my crits and have a very good chance of killing a boss, or of exploring an area.... Because as the game is now, I have to have like 4+ alts to really DO anything.... Wicked idea dognapot. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Mephistroth on 12/08/03 at 18:31:29 Well.. I expect you'd probably get quite a few people willing to play it. I know I would ;D |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by dognapot on 12/08/03 at 18:36:48 i've been thinking about the coding and i'm not sure how much is really neccessary. we can keep everything except the areas made since may of 2002 and all the coding that's been done to date. the only thing that i can think of that needs to be changed is making the 1-alt limit apply to all classes and not just pacifists. so really there'd only have to be one change, and we already know it's possible. jlh would know much better than i, but it seems like it would be fairly little work initially. however, area building would still be the same, but since the emphasis would be on making areas for individuals and small groups, it may not be neccessary to make expansive areas. also, since the playerbase would be smaller and the crit usage minimized, it wouldn't even be that wise to make a huge, expansive world. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Mephistroth on 12/08/03 at 18:40:41 You might need to change all the monsters though. Old monsters that you could easily beat with a few alts, would be next to impossible on your own. I know this would encourage grouping, but for a while at least I think it would be a good idea to make things slightly easier, as there might not be that many people to group with, and defiantly not around your level. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by dognapot on 12/08/03 at 18:46:59 of course, that's why area additions since like may of 2002 shouldn't be bothered with in the 1-alt world. but before may of 2002 i know 1 alt could get around easily. however, boss hp would have to be reduced to it's original state. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Snowy on 12/08/03 at 19:07:23 and even so it ll be less coding dont make site trading system, it ll be cool if u would roleplay buying stuff :D |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Rappy_Ninja on 12/08/03 at 19:31:37 on 12/08/03 at 15:16:10, Jurian wrote:
lmfao |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Stotic on 12/08/03 at 20:40:03 I've always loved the idea of the 1 alt limit. I have about 23 arches and I only log on one. Although everything can be a ray of sunshine and sound great, but it's the reality that needs to be understood. Ideas that are farfetch'd usually don't make their way into the game. This is certainly one of them. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Bean on 12/08/03 at 23:02:09 Its not farfetched at all... |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Despair on 12/08/03 at 23:11:14 maybe small steps towards this like a 3 alt limit |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by G Man on 12/08/03 at 23:28:27 I like the 3 alt limit idea. It seems that as it is now, the person with the fastest computer and best connection will win any duel or can kill any boss. It makes the game alot easier if you're running with 25 crits.... A limit of the number of logged on crits would make people concentrate more on making well rounded characters rather than a group of "specialists" |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Aladdin on 12/09/03 at 00:05:02 If we did go to a One alt at a time Server then you would have to increase maximum lvl to something, Create new Weapons, Armors, spells and new bosses/monsters Great idea, But there is still some Thinking needed before this idea is put into effect. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Stotic on 12/09/03 at 00:19:47 on 12/08/03 at 23:02:09, Bean wrote:
Running another server is farfetched. Mapping another world is farfetched. Hiring more staff to map that world is farfetched. The adjustment of monsterstats is farfetched. These aren't just click-a-button things to do. Notice that most of the suggestions put in are commands, aphabetization, etc. When was the last player suggested class put in? Or what about a new fighting style? Or weapons with abilities? Or even "Offline Nightmist." These would change Nightmist quite substantially making them farfetched ideas. I'm not saying JLH is lazy, but only so much is possible for such a small team. This posted idea would change Nightmist significantly. Anything in that department is "farfetched." Thank-you. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Bean on 12/09/03 at 02:15:28 /rant on Running another server isnt farfetched as dognapot pointed out. You wouldnt have to map another world so.... yeah that is farfetched. Hiring more staff would hardly be farfetched... There are plenty of capable competent people out there to do the job... The adjustment of monster stats I admit yes may be farfetched, But it can be done So it should not be dismissed just because its hard. Also, It would NOT change the world of nightmist much past the fact that some players would change from the un-restricted alt server to the newer restricted one. So I dont really understand that line right there. And I know a very large player idea that will take a good deal of coding/writing to be put in that is being worked on as we speak, so..... The reason the classes arent put in is because they are highly uneeded as well as very overpowered, The reason the weapons arent put in is because they also are overpowered. The reason the fighting styles arent put in is because... Well acctually Im not quite sure why stances are always rejected... And the reasons why offline nightmist isnt being implemented are obvious.... MY point in this whole above post is that YES it will be a lot of work, but NO it will not change the world of nightmist so dramatically that it is impossible. It shouldnt be thrown out simply because its too much coding, or because it will change the current system... The whole idea of suggestions is to change the way the system works. /rant off ~Bean~ P.S: No offense was intended by the above statement I simply voiced my opinion as It came to me, If it is rather abrasive please forgive me. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by dognapot on 12/09/03 at 02:25:52 stotic, think about it. all of the code already exists. initially it wouldn't require any more area than already exists. nor would it be neccessary to add more immediately, because there won't be many people on it anyways. changing monster stats isn't neccessary either because, as stated before, not all the areas that exist now should even be in this hypothetical server. so the only monster stats that would have to be edited would boss hp. the only thing i see here as being farfetched is the initial coding but it's also farfetched to believe that nightmist's greatest new additions will always be text colors, and organization. sooner or later something cool has to happen to this game. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Bean on 12/09/03 at 02:28:21 /nod dognapot |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Stotic on 12/09/03 at 02:36:46 It seems that you are defining my main statement as being it is impossible. It's improbable. This forum is made for people to pass their ideas and thoughts for this game. It is just an observement I've made in my stay in this community. It's the big ideas that never get put in. Stay simple and things get implemented. The more complicated it gets the longer it sits on the to-do list if it's noted in the first place. It seems that you're jumping to the defense of the initial idea (which is great). I am not confronting the idea, but the concept itself. The idea is equivocal, but not impossible. My main focus was to drill it into the brains of many is that the simpler your suggestions are the better chances they have at implementation. Things are sure to happen in the future, but those entirely uncertain. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Harky on 12/09/03 at 03:09:51 Best suggestion I've seen posted in a long time, I really hope something positive comes from JLH and/or Pandilex regarding this. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Bean on 12/09/03 at 03:10:06 Ah I beg to differ, I think a well thought out complex idea has just as much chance of being added as a simple idea. But then again, it doesnt happen as often nowadays... *Mainly because people insist on suggesting classes, and weapons....* But hey! What can ya do. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Melfice on 12/09/03 at 03:18:17 Now this idea is something i'd love to see put through, although probably it won't be 1 alt is something i've always wanted to be put into the game but many people don't approve so the seperate server is a good idea. The reason a seperate server and a 1 alt rule will be good is that the new server will be far more balanced. Currently with all the alts there are lots of people who are really powerful and own a lot and they have nothing left to do since they have everything. Staff try and solve this by making new items. As soon as the item is out everyone goes with all their alts and kills whatever and gets the item and it's all the same again. A new server means everyone can start again and build on one crit. People will be forced to work together and rp might actually exist in nightmist. It sounded better in my head but what i wrote isn't that groundbreaking lol, ah well |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Melfice on 12/09/03 at 03:43:46 If the seperate server is just going to be so much trouble then for an alternative suggestion how about the choice to convert or start a crit as a 1 alt crit which acts like the way a pacifist does in the alt respect. You should be entitled to something extra to encourage 1 alt gaming and to balance out odds since people with alts can survive a lot easier in nightmist etc. Just a suggestion.... /shrug |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by CPG on 12/09/03 at 04:35:52 I don't think monster stats should be adjusted. The only thing that would really suck is the monsters following you around...if this does happen, it should be made so the monsters don't follow you. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by dognapot on 12/09/03 at 04:42:48 melfice, i don't think that's neccessary or even workable. over a year ago there was a debate over whether nightmist should have a 1-alt rule. everyone was against pretty much, including me. it's just not fair to people who use one crit when there's been people who'll use as many as thier pc can handle to progress faster. and stotic, sorry for trying to shoot you down. i just think it's a bad thing for someone to discount an idea because it's not likely to be adopted. there's been alot of good ideas that we've seen that don't have a snowball's chance in hell, but we know that if there's a perceived need for something then there's a good chance that it'll be considered. i just happen to think that something like this is needed, and eventually found the way it could be accomplished with the least amount of work. that's probably why i jumped to the defense. it's really simple in essence, and accomplishes what it promises with minimal work. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Issy on 12/09/03 at 14:53:43 back a very long time ago (reset, and after the reset about a month) you were considered an awesome player if you could kill people with 1 crit. I also have to agree with Stotic, the idea is greatly 'farfetch'd,' but it is still a great idea. Playing with 1 crit would probably be -alot- of fun, and more of a challenge. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by pOrKiE on 12/09/03 at 19:57:49 i think its a great idea, and as others have said will encourage teaming, and more friendship. but, i see lots of pallys about if it does commence. but as a conclusion, i love the idea it would possibly encourage roleplaying mebe.. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Bean on 12/09/03 at 20:23:42 Your all forgetting to add this key phrase at the end of your sentences so no one gets confused :P 'on the other server which you have a CHOICE to use.' Lol Just makin sure that people know this wouldnt mean you have to play on it if you dont want to. :) |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Lich on 12/09/03 at 20:47:21 on 12/09/03 at 04:42:48, dognapot wrote:
Thats the point if you say ok starting from this date you will only be allowed to use one alt at a time you dont need to adjust anything and fair how is it unfair. If you have everything the game offers right now cool great grand.. But from that date on everyone will be on equal playing field ok i dont have everything So i have to get it. To say it will be unfair means its unfair now... It would not be alot of coding to change the server that exists and you dont even have to change the world just the crits themselves leave all the rest alone and it will mean all those big bad peeeps who have it all now if they wish to continue to have it all will have to work with other people. It will not bring down the value of a crit because people will still be out looking for better crits than the one they have because you can still have more than one alt you just cant play them all at the same time. I think the idea is great and I would love to see it implemented and i would switch servers in a heart beat if it does but if it makes it easier to just change one line of coding to a group of crits right now then do that. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by dognapot on 12/09/03 at 21:56:28 how will it be fair? if everyone who played before a 1-alt rule got to train faster, gain money faster, and sell crits for more gold. while everyone who plays after that is working on a much, much, smaller scale. it would just cement the lead that a few players have over everyone else. kind of like making a "you'll never catch up now" rule. it's just not fair to any newer players if everyone took advantage what is essentially a 2 year head start. also, crits will be worth less if you can only use one at a time, and can't gain money as fast. it's supply and demand. if there's less ability to use more crits, then there'll be less demand for more crits. likewise if the nightmist economy can only grow at a fraction of the pace it does now, then there'll be less people who'll pay as much for what they would now. that's why i think it's neccessary to put the 1-alt rule on a different nightmist server. the playing field would be even from the beginning. i think just implementing a 1-alt rule on the server now would do much more harm than good for nightmist. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Melfice on 12/09/03 at 22:50:55 Actually i disagree.... The whole, you'll never catch us now thing, is upon is now. People have been training and geting gold/items for years and their account is constantly growing and they are constantly becoming more powerful in game. New players just can't catch up to that since by the time they have matched the account of the top players, all those top players have grow far stronger. With an 1 alt rule however, people will only be powerful in game as 1 character, meaning no matter how much you have in your account its how powerful one crit is and how you play it. Then we have a chance. But i do agree that inputting this into the original server will not go down well like i previously stated, no matter how long you have worked for all your stuff in your account it someone has just one crit they could be better than you. Holding it on a seperate server would be perfect. So i'm straight, the seperate server would work like the phoenix/dragon servers on legend of mir run? Or diablo's europe/us etc servers if you havn't played mir. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Spekkio on 12/10/03 at 01:30:23 Having more than one alt takes away from Roll Playing, in my opinion. Everybody gets so scared everytime somebody mentions a reset. Personally I would love a reset, you have to remember one thing.... it's only a game. Having only one alt on at a time would force people to unite to get things done, isn't that the idea of clans? I believe that this would greatly help Night Mist in its development toward perfection. I have been talking about this to my irl friends that play for a long time now. Thanks for bringing this up... I haven't been on much, because there really isn't much I can do. My dial up sucks and I can't have very many alts online, not to mention all the lag caused by 300 crits being online at the same time. It may be a lot of work.... but it's worth it! |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by dognapot on 12/10/03 at 01:36:46 on 12/10/03 at 01:30:23, Spekkio wrote:
just re-iterating things here. the 1-alt rule would only apply to a different nightmist world that doesn't interact with the one we play now. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Spekkio on 12/10/03 at 01:39:57 on 12/10/03 at 01:36:46, dognapot wrote:
I know... but "I" wouldn't mind another reset. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by CPG on 12/10/03 at 02:07:04 What would be really nice in my own opinion is not being able to transfer crits from acct to acct on the new server. That would define players. Roll and lvl your own stuff...then we'll see who is the shizzat. If you didn't catch it, it means no trading of crits. That is, unless, you trade accounts. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Spekkio on 12/10/03 at 02:50:22 on 12/10/03 at 02:07:04, CPG wrote:
Yea... that would be nice, because unless you are a NightMist Hooker... you shouldn't be selling your body! :P |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Bean on 12/10/03 at 06:08:37 /t melfice the whole point behind doggys post was... If everyone was allowed to use as many alts as their comp could handle to level, and got a massively huge army of alts, and then this alt restriction was put in, the people who played AFTER the alt restriction would have no chance whatsoever at catching up in any way But as it stands right now, everyone can use as many alts as they want etc, etc so you have an equal chance of catching up to someone, and YES it is possible, because a lot of the powerful people think that because they are powerful they dont need to train lots. so they sit at SGH and chat while other people are training all day, etc etc... Gah nevermind your not gonna get my point anyways. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Pandilex on 12/20/03 at 08:52:17 Not sure how I missed this post... Saw a link elsewhere. Anyway, in my opinion, yes the game should definately be one-alt only. However because of the way the game has evolved, this is not possible without so many alterations to the system that it would be a waste of time. Therefore the solution is to run a new server, and the chances are, pay to play will be another server (the current one remaining free), which has more features, classes, etc (Theoretically a brand new game system which I devised some time ago) not to mention a brand new map. This server will be pay-to-play, although I suspect it may start out being free for testing purposes. Don't take any of this information to be solid, or ask for updates because this isn't even in development, it is just a possible plan for the future. I also have some tricks of my own that are hiding up my sleeve, which are most interesting. However, unfortunately this will remain invisible for the meantime as time constraints are pretty tight and it's hard to do work in full time education (Lucky that nightmist was started before university, otherwise it may never have had the effort put in that it needed to take off). I dare say next year will have some interesting things in store, particularly during and after summer. The year after that, well... I can tell you there's going to be some VERY interesting things by that stage. Deadlines are never certain though, so don't be expecting anything, and don't take any of this information as some sort of huge update, as only a few plans and ideas have been thrown around. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Bun on 12/21/03 at 22:48:29 pay to play would be sooo much better but would it be like one big sum or monthly |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by JLH on 12/21/03 at 22:53:44 whenever you wanted to pay, more points would appear in your account for distribution over the crits you choose. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by BadAngel on 12/26/03 at 16:19:37 I luv the idea of a single alt nightmist and it was great to see that pandi is up w/ it as well. :) What has happened to the pre-reset nightmist? Ive heard so much about it im very curious as to where it is or if it still exists. Could that pre-reset world be a more hospitable home for the one alt nightmist? |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Oracle on 12/26/03 at 16:56:32 It is lost sadly, you could in a sense say that was the testing version before this one was released. There is no way it can come back. |
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Title: Re: more insanity! Post by Windwalker on 12/26/03 at 21:00:05 ok i dont like this idea for the following reasons 1. JLH is run off his feet as it is 2. it would still become large parties just of alot of different players or different accounts 3. it would bacome boring as hell |
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