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        Nightmist Online - Please read the terms of use before posting here >> Discussion Forum >> Why not?
        
(Message started by: Epic on 09/15/03 at 05:31:02)

Title: Why not?
Post by Epic on 09/15/03 at 05:31:02

I'm just wondering why you cant buy/sell crits, gold or items for real money...i'm not ever thinking about spending cash and buying anything for *laughs heartily* Nightmist...i just want to know why you cant buy/sell things for real money and why some people have in the past and nothings happened to them.

Title: Re: Why not?
Post by Despair on 09/15/03 at 05:37:38

Something that may be concidered/totally flamed would be for all irl cash trades to go via JLH who takes a % cut from the trade to donate to the server *Shrug*

Just a though

Title: Re: Why not?
Post by -Gaddy- on 09/15/03 at 05:47:50

I think with how pissed the adminds got last time, we should just drop the whole spending irl money thing.

Title: Re: Why not?
Post by Aidon on 09/15/03 at 05:49:07

Spending irl money on NM items screws up NM's economy. It goes on the same principle of not trading NM and other game items.

Title: Re: Why not?
Post by Epic on 09/15/03 at 07:44:20

How does it mess up the "economy" exactly...im not following

Title: Re: Why not?
Post by Cupcake on 09/15/03 at 07:52:01

Im sure its because they feel people are makin bread off their game while they sit back and make nuts. Whos fault is that...just because you broke annoyances arent chargin for the game dont mean i cant charge for mine :)

Title: Re: Why not?
Post by Jurian on 09/15/03 at 08:03:45

well everytime i donate i try to convince jlh to give me a cobalt but every time he sais "that would give you an unfair advantage towards the other players"

guess it's the same with buy'n crits and stuff

Title: Re: Why not?
Post by Cupcake on 09/15/03 at 08:05:56

no.....if you were to pay cash for a cobalt...thats adding to the game....all were doing is exchanging what already exists...we were adding anything.

Title: Re: Why not?
Post by Anonymous0 on 09/15/03 at 08:29:04

No, whut hes saying is that it throws the game off balance. Like someone could be more powerful in game and kill 2x players, or make an excessive amount of gold and throw off rankings because of things they bought with rl money. It gives them unfair advantage.

Title: Re: Why not?
Post by Oz on 09/15/03 at 14:33:51

on 09/15/03 at 08:29:04, Anonymous0 wrote:

OK, and the difference between that and giving crits/items away and/or sharing accounts is.........?

Title: Re: Why not?
Post by Anonymous0 on 09/15/03 at 16:19:09

That if you were allowed to sell tihngs on nm for real money then it would happen alot more than people just giving things away. And sharing crits does not give unfair advantage.

Title: Re: Why not?
Post by Bean on 09/15/03 at 17:45:24

I think the point is any noob with a spare 500 bucks could buy an account filled with lvl 30's and questies, and own the entire game without having to know the ins and outs of the game at all...

While on the other hand if that same noob had to roll his own chars, level them, sell them, buy some better stated chars, level them as well, and then have an amassed fortune, he would know the ins and outs of the game because he acctually had to play it to get what he wanted.

Title: Re: Why not?
Post by Sausage on 09/15/03 at 17:48:20

You mean just like the n00b that had Boots of Haste? ::)

Title: Re: Why not?
Post by Eternyte on 09/15/03 at 17:53:24

Technically he didnt buy them though. Well not technically, he didnt buy them, he got them by winning the 'quest'.

Title: Re: Why not?
Post by Sausage on 09/15/03 at 18:13:30

on 09/15/03 at 17:45:24, Bean wrote:

I an account filled with lvl 30's and questies, and own the entire game without having to know the ins and outs of the game at all...

I wasn't saying he bought them. But the two situations have the same outcome.

Title: Re: Why not?
Post by Epic on 09/15/03 at 18:15:03

on 09/15/03 at 17:45:24, Bean wrote:

I think the point is any noob with a spare 500 bucks could buy an account filled with lvl 30's and questies, and own the entire game without having to know the ins and outs of the game at all...

Please...people on here have been given many things and still most of those moochers dont compair to others that dont have the same ammt of items...so people have it and some dont....i think the players making cash that bothers certain people..

Title: Re: Why not?
Post by Lady_Maha on 09/15/03 at 19:05:57

Personally I don't think it has a lot to do with balance in the game.

The one explanation that sounds reasonable to me however is this:

The game was created by JLH and Pandilex, who spend a pretty large amount on keeping it running. Technically everything on that NM server belongs to them, we are merely granted the priviledge of using that server for our enjoyment.

So when we sell game items for rl money, we aren't even selling something that belongs to us, we are selling JLH's and Pandilex's property.

Even if the game goes p2p, we wouldn't be paying to "own" the accounts, we would pay for the privilege of using the game server. Everything on it still belongs to JLH and Pandilex.

Hence, the only people who would be allowed to sell those things, were the two head gurus.

Title: Re: Why not?
Post by Oz on 09/15/03 at 21:11:27

In such a case then, why not make it so if crits/items are sold for rl cash, the person(s) who shell out the monies are required to pay JLH/Pandiles RL cash in order to use said accounts/items. Thusly enabling them(the buyer) to get what they want and also aid in the the maintenance costs of MN.

If something is sought after, it can be obtained, I'm sure it does happen as well, and it goes un-noticed. Not everyone is stupid in such respect.

Title: Re: Why not?
Post by dognapot on 09/15/03 at 21:29:34

think about it guys, it doesn't really screw up the nightmist economy. unlimited time+monsters screws it up far worse. i don't know what pan and jlh are pissed about in this respect but if i were in thier place i'd be mad as hell that people are making money off of my work.

now you may say that you worked hard to achieve your inventory of items and crits but they're still not yours. the crits you make are parts of a game that is not yours. if you tried to sell someone your savegame on your friend's console and cartridge we could all agree that you would be in the wrong. this is no different. just drop it guys.

edit for typos. i'm sleepy.

Title: Re: Why not?
Post by Insomnia on 09/15/03 at 22:06:20

What bothers me is that some people who try to sell their stuff for RL cash sells it cause they need the money. I tried to sell some of my stuff because I'm in debt, and I'm in school without having a work. I have a few choices; one is to sell things I got in my house (like TV, CD's, Stereo), another one is to sell stuff I got on NM. I'm sure most of you understands that I'd kind of enjoy keeping things like my TV as long as I can, but what about my stuff on here? *idea* I can sell most of it and get a nice chunk of money, but still keep enough crits to play the game! Selling things on here doesn't hurt anyone. JLH or Pandilex can't get in trouble for it, both me and the buyer are happy with it, so what's the problem?

Unfortunately, JLH and Pandilex would rather screw my RL up than letting me do a trade that everyone's fine with. Since they can't get in trouble because of this, in any way, I figured that the only possible reason is that they don't give a **** about me or other players sharing the same IRL problems. They'd rather stick with their silly principles than allowing me to keep a fair life... just because they can?

Bottom line; thanks JLH and Pandilex for doing your best to take away the good things I've got in my life. You've got the chance to help me out really much without lifting a finger, but instead you put effort in doing the opposite. Thank you very much.

Title: Re: Why not?
Post by Infiniti on 09/15/03 at 23:18:07

this is in no way intended against you insomnia, or anyone else it has happened to, but personally if someone was making more from selling some crits and items than I had made in donations on a game I created I would start thinking why should people be making profit from my work when I wouldnt be.

*shrugs*

Title: Re: Why not?
Post by Lady_Maha on 09/16/03 at 05:38:29

Think about it, Insomnia. You are selling something that doesn't even belong to you. It's sad if you are in a financially bad situation, but it's even sadder to sell someone else's work to get out of that.

Don't blame JLH and Pandilex for your misery.

Title: Re: Why not?
Post by Eiements on 09/16/03 at 05:53:50

ok i know it unblances the game and all but hows it diffrent from someone giving their account to you when they leave? or a newb killing a quest boss and getting 30 mil for it? i say if yall are so good at tracking people down and dont want the game to be unblanced you should just track down people quiting and delete their stuff and recycle it back into the game giving newer players a chance to get nice stuff cause the way its going in nightmist now its very rare to see anyone not already super over powerd getting a quest item

Title: Re: Why not?
Post by Argus on 09/16/03 at 19:52:20

* nods in agreement with Eiements

Title: Re: Why not?
Post by dognapot on 09/16/03 at 22:26:34

eiements, it's ethically different.

Title: Re: Why not?
Post by Argus on 09/16/03 at 22:56:16

how do you figure it is different? It's exactly the same scenario.

Title: Re: Why not?
Post by dognapot on 09/17/03 at 00:12:45

aside from the fact that one is a financial agreement and one is a gift. christmas must be confusing at your house.

Title: Re: Why not?
Post by Deval on 09/17/03 at 00:18:35

* prays
Lord, please give Dognapots cat Gary a pensi and some feets.

Title: Re: Why not?
Post by Eiements on 09/17/03 at 01:54:13

so your telling me if i get a house for my xmas and my parents buy me everything. that means its not unblanced everyone has a chance to get a free house? they just dont want it or something? no life is unblanced just like nightmist the only way alot power really shifts in nightmist is when someone leaves and gives their account away or sells it. its been like that for a while and i dont see it changing anytime soon

Title: Re: Why not?
Post by CPG on 09/17/03 at 02:33:12

on 09/16/03 at 05:38:29, Lady_Maha wrote:

You are selling something that doesn't even belong to you.

Well then, if that's the case, there should be no ingame buying/selling of crits either. Technically, we don't own any of this stuff, whether it be crits or gold or items etc. Yeah, go buy a crit with gold that's not yours.

If you tell me that this doesn't make sense, i'll kick you in the head...real good.

Title: Re: Why not?
Post by Aidon on 09/17/03 at 02:37:58

The game is made to have trading within it using the currency that was made for the game, bring in IRL money is quite different. If you dont understand how they differ I suggest looking up some law on the subject. Why else do you think there are retainers that sell D2 items saying that you are buying the act of getting the items, not the items themselves? Probably because it is against the law to make profit off of copyrighted work.

Title: Re: Why not?
Post by dognapot on 09/17/03 at 03:06:52

on 09/17/03 at 02:33:12, CPG wrote:

If you tell me that this doesn't make sense, i'll kick you in the head...real good.

you're gonna want to get your kickin' boots. i'm starting to think pan just told everyone that this irl $$ trading is screwing up the nightmist economy because everyone is too dim to understand something that does makes sense. there's a game, and there's life. the two are seperate.

anyways, for those who'd like to play a mmorpg that does let you sell game items for irl $$$ there's progress quest (http://www.progressquest.com). i think they may even encourage it.

Title: Re: Why not?
Post by Eiements on 09/17/03 at 03:13:41

Im not saying id ever buy anything in this game or any other game, but i just think if theres a prob with buying stuff and selling stuff its not so much that it will unblance the game, cause so does leaving and giving away an account just as much. its that it is just dumb its like theres really nothing there. its just a game, a text game at that. I mean yea its the best game ive ever playied, but still spending or making money on it is just dumb

Title: Re: Why not?
Post by Lady_Maha on 09/17/03 at 06:32:33

on 09/17/03 at 02:33:12, CPG wrote:

You are really tense lately, come kick me.

The trades ingame are VIRTUAL gold and VIRTUAL beings and VIRTUAL items. trading them between accounts keeps the VIRTUAL stuff on the server and server only.

When you play monopoly, you don't buy streets with real money either, do you?

Title: Re: Why not?
Post by Aidon on 09/17/03 at 06:40:03

I can see Newb grabbin at his wallet so he can win at monopoly, lmao.

Title: Re: Why not?
Post by Oz on 09/17/03 at 16:17:03

on 09/17/03 at 06:32:33, Lady_Maha wrote:

When you play monopoly, you don't buy streets with real money either, do you?

It does Happen in RL. They call this Real Estate for the Rich.